Weekend Long Read: Muhammad Yunus on Creating a ‘New Bangladesh’
(Davos, Switzerland) — Bangladeshi economist Muhammad Yunus won the Nobel Peace Prize in 2006 for founding the Grameen Bank in 1983, born out of a pilot project he started in 1976 to alleviate poverty and empower the country’s marginalized poor through microcredit.
Last year, at the age of 84, Yunus stepped into a new role as a politician. After the resignation of Bangladesh’s Prime Minister Sheikh Hasina on Aug. 5 following weeks of nationwide protests against her 15-year rule, President Mohammed Shahabuddin appointed him to form an interim government and to be its chief advisor. He took the oath of office on Aug. 8.
Yunus faces tremendous challenges, not least rebuilding social order and national consensus; channeling the surging desire for change into a feasible path of transformation and economic, political and social reform; and mapping out a plan for economic recovery and development.
The interim government has established 15 reform commissions to redesign the nation’s institutions. They will cover areas including the electoral system, police administration, judicial system reform, anti-corruption, public administration reform, constitutional amendments, health care system reform, mass media, labor rights and women’s affairs.
Each commission has been tasked with putting together reform proposals within their specific field and submitting a special report to the interim government. These reports will be studied by a National Consensus Commission, chaired by Yunus, and serve as the basis for political parties to reach a consensus, which will be incorporated into a document known as the July Charter, in recognition of the protests, for all parties to sign.
A general election will then be held based on the new consensus and a new electoral system. Finally, the power of the interim government will be transferred to the newly elected government, which will be responsible for the subsequent implementation of various reform agreements.
Last month’s World Economic Forum in Davos provided Yunus with the ideal venue to expound on his plans to the international community and to meet with key international figures, including U.N. Secretary-General António Guterres, outgoing German Chancellor Olaf Scholz, European Central Bank President Christine Lagarde, Thai Prime Minister Paetongtarn Shinawatra, and the U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights Volker Türk. He also sought support for Bangladesh from a range of organizations and figures in the public and private sectors.
Meanwhile, he sat down for an exclusive interview with Caixin, where he discussed issues including his ambitious plans for Bangladesh, and the country’s current and future relationship with China, including how the two sides will deal with Bangladesh’s debts.
Below are the main excerpts from the interview.
Caixin: What has been your biggest challenge since taking on the role of special advisor?
Yunus: The biggest challenge has been running a government. The challenge for us, particularly the team that forms the government now, is that we are not in the habit of running governments. Most of the time, we were fighting against the government, fighting for human rights, for women’s rights, for environmental rights. Most are activists of different kinds. Together, we now run the country, take the problems as they emerge.
Our first major problem was restoring law and order and the second was the economy — how to reshape the economy, because of the terrible destruction that took place over the past 16 years of misrule. A lot of plundering went on, a lot of stealing went on, so lots of resources have been shifted away from Bangladesh for personal gain. Institutions were not functioning, banking was not functioning, we had problems with the administration, the judiciary and everything. So, our first job is to make sure that the economy starts to take shape, the banking system starts working and industries start functioning. So that was the first task and we have done that significantly.
Our foreign exchange reserves went to the bottom, so we had to rebuild our reserves. We have lots of bills to pay — because the previous government was borrowing money everywhere. We had to pay the bills, but we didn’t have the money, so we had to find the money to make it happen. We also had to continue our imports so that our businesses can continue to use those imported goods as raw materials, make sure that people have enough income so that they can maintain their lives.
So, we are going through these challenges.
After the dramatic changes that shocked the world, your current responsibilities include leading Bangladeshi society in building a new national consensus and a new constitutional order. How do you plan to achieve this?
One is law and order, the first priority. The second priority is to bring discipline and reestablish the economy, and the third is the future — where we go from here.
Students want to have a large reform agenda and are always talking about creating a “New Bangladesh.” This is a good idea, meaning that we depart from all the things that happened and make sure it doesn’t repeat.
We have to go back and amend the constitution, change the roads that led the nation into difficulty, and make sure that the new elections are transparent.
So, we have created 15 reform commissions to tell us what is the best way to reform these areas. We gave them 90 days and those 90 days are over, so we are hoping to get their reports in a few days. Then we will attempt to find consensus, where everybody agrees. On the basis of that agreement, we will produce a document as a charter, the July Charter. We need all political parties, all civil society to agree on it and we will ask them to sign it. So it will become a charter and we will implement it.
We have announced elections, which we said could be done at the earliest at the end of this year, provided we can agree on a shortlist of reforms. We cannot do all of it. If the public want to do more reforms, then we will need at least six more months, so that takes us either to December or June next year. The newly elected government resulting from the next general election will be committed to the subsequent implementation. This is what we are seeking.
What are your economic priorities for the country?
We want to focus on opening the doors for everyone so that we can become the workplace for every country and produce things for every country. We have a very young population, very capable young people, technology-oriented people. Give us a chance so that we can do things for you. So, the priority is openness.
In your past career, you placed great emphasis on the concept of ESG (environmental, social, and corporate governance) as well as poverty alleviation practices like the Grameen Bank. Will you put your ideas into the agenda for the country during your leadership?
I have two roles. One is to run the government. That’s to follow the immediate needs of the people. The other role is what I’ve been promoting as a person — the “Three Zeros World” (a world of zero emissions, zero unemployment, and zero wealth concentration) and to persuade the whole world to follow this. The civilization that we created now is the wrong civilization and it’s a self-destructive civilization. If we continue with this civilization, we will all be finished, destroyed. So, before we do that, we need to start creating a new civilization, get rid of all the bad things that we have been doing, clean it up and have a better civilization.
After you took the role of chief adviser to the interim government, you met with Yao Wen, the Chinese ambassador to Bangladesh, and also met with China’s Foreign Minister Wang Yi. Your foreign affairs advisor has also visited China recently. Can you provide some details about your interactions with China?
We have a wonderful relationship with China. China wants to help us and we are very happy to have friends like China with us. China has been involved in many projects in Bangladesh. We want more support, economic support, such as establishing more solar panel and other manufacturing in Bangladesh. There are so many things on the agenda that we would like to pursue.
There have been reports of progress on the issue of Bangladesh delaying loan repayments to China. Are the negotiations going smoothly?
We owe money to China and we have to pay. So, we are in negotiations to reschedule the repayments, and hopefully we will have more support coming in. One loan will not determine our future, we will need lots of support. China and Bangladesh already have a very good and close relationship, and we want to strengthen this relationship.
In recent years, we’ve seen a major trend of Chinese companies going global, with many already operating successfully overseas, including in Bangladesh.
That’s right. We hope for more. You have talent, infrastructure, and everything else, and you helped us build this infrastructure. Now, let’s use it to your benefit and our benefit together. You relocate your industries to Bangladesh so that you can sell your products anywhere in the world as products made in Bangladesh.
In some countries, there are restrictions on importing goods from China. You can avoid that. You can produce in Bangladesh and then sell anywhere you want.
What role do you think China will play in the next phase of Bangladesh’s development?
China can play a very strong role. You have already played a very strong role in Bangladesh. Our relations have led us to have a very close collaboration. We want to continue and strengthen it.
There is growing commentary that the success of your government’s reforms may depend on the attitude of the Trump administration. How do you plan to engage with the new U.S. government?
We are not saying that the U.S. will not pay attention to us. The new administration has to figure out what their whole foreign policy will be and where Bangladesh will feature. I don’t think Bangladesh will feature as a top priority for U.S. government policy. I was hoping there would be a continuation of their policy, but we cannot guarantee anything unless President Trump announces this policy, so we hope our relationship will continue to be a close one.
This interview has been edited for length and clarity.
Contact editor Nerys Avery (nerysavery@caixin.com)
caixinglobal.com is the English-language online news portal of Chinese financial and business news media group Caixin. Global Neighbours is authorized to reprint this article.
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